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Post by Sarfrin on Sept 26, 2021 11:03:45 GMT
Another recommendation for Soma here, although I played it in safe mode because I'm a big coward when it comes to horror games. Yup same here. Really enjoyed soma. Has amnesia aged well? Always wanted to play it but never got round to it. I managed about half an hour and gave up. Too scary.
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Dgzter
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Post by Dgzter on Sept 26, 2021 11:05:05 GMT
Re: Song of Horror at the moment I'm leaning towards Tormented Souls, the competing product, it just seems more evocative of 90s and earlier 2000s horror games. Hadn't even heard of Tormented Souls. There appears to be a demo on Steam, going to give it a try
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Dgzter
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Post by Dgzter on Sept 26, 2021 13:51:20 GMT
Re: Song of Horror at the moment I'm leaning towards Tormented Souls, the competing product, it just seems more evocative of 90s and earlier 2000s horror games. Hadn't even heard of Tormented Souls. There appears to be a demo on Steam, going to give it a try Okay. Downloaded demo. Played demo. Uninstalled demo. Purchased full game. Fuck me this is the closest to old school Resi and Silent Hill I've seen in a long time. Can't believe I'd never even heard of it.
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Sept 27, 2021 9:32:15 GMT
I'm still holding out for the PS4 physical version of Tormented Souls, it's still TBA with a placeholder release date on Amazon and TBA everywhere else. Possibly some time next year I guess.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2021 9:39:04 GMT
I do fancy Tormented Souls. Played the demo and it's definitely got that old school vibe. Think I'm going to leave it nearer to mid-late October though. Mind you I never finished Silent Hill 4 that I started last October after going through SH 2 & 3...
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 1, 2021 19:17:00 GMT
It's the first and today's game is D. They were wrong, 32-Bit generation games have started to accrue some charm. I was amused to discover the protagonist has a self preservation instinct, trying to make her walk near a trap results in a subtle shake of the head and a refusal. Playing the most recent Tomb Raider reboot title I'd started to find Lara so incredibly loathsome I was actively looking for ways to kill her and I realised that there must be a sub-set of gamers who are looking for all the possible ways to kill a player character.
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Post by One_Vurfed_Gwrx on Oct 1, 2021 19:20:19 GMT
I was pleasantly surprised by D back in the day on Saturn. Short and easy but Warp games were usually fun. Wonder if this year I can finally finish Project Zero 4 . Got Maid of Sker sitting there too and that should be fairly short...
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malek86
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Post by malek86 on Oct 1, 2021 19:36:06 GMT
Enemy Zero is a much better game than D though. Everyone should play it.
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Post by One_Vurfed_Gwrx on Oct 1, 2021 20:54:23 GMT
Enemy Zero is a much better game than D though. Everyone should play it. Evil on the normal difficulty though with limited saves AND loads... Didn't quite finish it and mean to go back to it one day...
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 1, 2021 23:48:26 GMT
D completed with both good and bad ending.
An interesting piece of gaming pre-history, it's all early tech, FMV runs at the limitations of the 3DO, so not that far removed from Sega CD. D has early motion capture but the tech for facial capture wasn't there yet and the original model has too few points of articulation to do expressions very well. Laura looks like a blow-up doll whenever they try to have her emote and look surprised. Unintended hilarity ensues, especially combined with voice acting which makes House of the Dead 2 look like the Royal Shakespeare Company.
Possibly the first quicktime event too, suck it Shenmue. It makes sense, it had to have come from the FMV game lineage. There may be even earlier examples of on-screen prompts corresponding to directions & buttons on the controller to navigate an action sequence. The D quicktime event is interesting, you get just one in the entire game and the timings for the prompts are incredibly exacting on the PS1 version at the very least. I failed at least 20 times, easily.
So a pioneering game in many respects. When nearly everything you're doing is new there are going to be stumbles along the way.
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malek86
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Post by malek86 on Oct 2, 2021 10:59:45 GMT
D reminded me a lot of the eariler Mansion of Hidden Souls. That game also had no HUD, relatively simple puzzles that relied on getting items from one place to the other, occasional instant death events, and even the same two hours timer. It's also a much more charming game overall, even if the FMV quality is absolutely terrible today (there is seemingly no compression at all, so you are looking at videos that run at maybe 5fps).
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Post by Chopper on Oct 2, 2021 16:35:58 GMT
Overall The Evil Within is incredibly uneven and poorly paced with survival horror resource drops in a game with locked room Resident Evil 4 action scenarios where you can't stealth things as you did earlier in the game. Meanwhile you're picking up drops of two and even one measly bullet. Basically I ended up getting chased around until an enemy obliged and team killed most of their friends with a rocket, I walked out with practically every weapon dry. Agree wholeheartedly on this, but I'd like to recommend The Evil Within 2 if anyone's looking for an offbeat horror game for this month. It does start out really badly, with the same 'fleeing down a corridor dripping with blood' nonsense of the first game, but that soon changes to a semi-open world type of setup and there is proper scavenging and some tactical nous is involved in the gameplay - when and how to take a particular enemy on, etc. It's surprisingly good.
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Dgzter
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Post by Dgzter on Oct 2, 2021 16:49:44 GMT
I actually finished a TEW2 playthrough quite recently. I loved both games, and the IP in general, though Cappy's criticisms of the first game there are perfectly valid. I also seem to recall it suffering from an obscene difficulty spike at one point around Ch.12-13, if I recall correctly, which was just brutal/tedious at higher difficulty levels.
The second game is definitely superior, and I also thought the semi-open world setup worked well. They've added an NG+ and a few 'cheat' toggles in the menu since launch, which enables you to start again with all your unlocked powers and weapons, as well as toggling off stamina depletion, enabling God mode, and one-hit kills for regular mobs, which may all sound like super cheese, but is actually immensely satisfying for subsequent playthroughs (especially if you just happened to miss one fucking lore Slide!).
Really hope we some more entries in the series.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2021 17:02:15 GMT
I really wanted to like TEW2 as actually loved the first. It is decent but weirdly (and I don't normally notice or complain about such things) the pop in is so bad it's distracting.
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Dgzter
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Post by Dgzter on Oct 2, 2021 17:06:20 GMT
Was that on console, Wunty? I played on PC and didn't have too much pop-in, but yeah it definitely does exist. The more annoying thing I had was at 1440p the game didn't seem to want to render the document/item description text clearly, but dropping down to 1080p fixed that issue. Very strange. There is undoubtedly a lot of clunk about the game as well, to be fair. Still love it though
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Post by Aunt Alison on Oct 2, 2021 17:08:34 GMT
I didn't finish it but really enjoyed what I played of TEW2 and that woman freaked me out whenever she showed up. I've started the first one a couple of times but the framerate always seems terrible to me (on PS4)
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Dgzter
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Post by Dgzter on Oct 2, 2021 17:15:20 GMT
Anima? Haha, yeah. She is genuinely fucking terrifying, in both the scripted and random encounters.
That eerie version of Clair de Lune she hums is absolutely haunting. She was a great addition.
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 2, 2021 17:59:06 GMT
I'm getting PTSD just from being reminded that The Evil Within exists.
The thing is, I'm really, really careful with ammunition in games. Any opportunity for stealth kills was taken in The Evil Within, even if I had to waste 10 minutes hiding in wardrobes. Still, at the end of the game I'm bombarded with waves of enemies and nowhere near enough ammunition.
I know that drops are randomised so you can get really lucky and get loads of bullets and a health item, die and get absolute squat when retrying the exact same section but The Evil Within actively prevents you from 'survival horroring' out of the problem with the ridiculously low carry limits for ammunition. Are you sure you couldn't carry just one more itty bitty shotgun cartridge Sebastian? No? What are you doing? Holding them between the cheeks of your arse? Is this what I'm upgrading so you can carry a couple more, arse grip strength?
Forget it. I'll just use melee weapons instead... THEY BREAK. AXES BREAK. MEANWHILE THE KNIFE MIGHT AS WELL BE A FEATHER DUSTER UNLESS IT"S A STEALTH KILL.
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 2, 2021 18:03:28 GMT
Anyway tonight's game is Silent Hill, the plan is a different game every night through October but that may be too much.
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Dgzter
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Post by Dgzter on Oct 2, 2021 18:05:47 GMT
Ah, nice one. A classic. I'm currently balancing Tormented Souls and Song of Horror (when I'm not in the queue for New World).
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2021 18:08:00 GMT
Was that on console, Wunty? I played on PC and didn't have too much pop-in, but yeah it definitely does exist. The more annoying thing I had was at 1440p the game didn't seem to want to render the document/item description text clearly, but dropping down to 1080p fixed that issue. Very strange. There is undoubtedly a lot of clunk about the game as well, to be fair. Still love it though Yeah PS4 version on PS5. It's genuinely so bad the open world bits just looked awful.
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Post by Aunt Alison on Oct 2, 2021 18:48:45 GMT
Anima? Haha, yeah. She is genuinely fucking terrifying, in both the scripted and random encounters. That eerie version of Clair de Lune she hums is absolutely haunting. She was a great addition. Sounds like her. I think there's a section early on where you're trapped in a small building with her and have to let her float into you, ugh. I've had actual nightmares like that
Horror games are so weird. I like them but I'm never really sure if I enjoy them. I remember playing Silent Hill 2 and I'd have to really psych myself up to sit down with it and as soon as I started playing I'd constantly be thinking 'I've played it for half an hour, that's enough, I can stop now.'
I also vividly remember playing the System Shock 2 demo without knowing what it was and was looking in the crate in the room on the left after you enter the first main floor (after you see the ghost) and suddenly heard a zombie behind me for the first time before it hit me and it actually made me scream. Took the disc out and pushed it behind the back of the desk. Was at least 20 years before I went back to it
I can manage Resi though
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Post by Cappy on Oct 3, 2021 18:59:43 GMT
How absurdly wide are the streets of Silent Hill? Let's find out.
Harry Mason seems to be an average size human male, using an average human male pace I'm getting 16.5 Metres or approximately 54.1 Ft. That's enough for a four lane dual carriageway with a central reservation based on UK standard road widths.
Everything really is bigger in the States. I was wondering if it was a way of offloading rendering but the engine seems to handle the considerably narrower alleyways just fine, I guess it was an artistic decision to enhance the feeling of being lost and disorientated.
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Rodderz
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Post by Rodderz on Oct 4, 2021 10:08:03 GMT
Silent Hill is one of those games that really shit me up when I was younger. I remember getting on with it just fine up until I hit the school location and then the grimy, oppressive, nightmarish atmosphere really hit me. That bloody static on the radio and the sounds of babies crying made me want to crawl into a corner.
I borrowed a magazine from a school mate with a complete guide to the game and grudgingly powered through it over a single weekend. I was relieved when it was all over and vowed to never to play it again, that's how much of an effect it had on me. To this day I haven't played it again and actually didn't (foolishly) play any other Silent Hill games either. I know I would enjoy them now!
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Post by Chopper on Oct 4, 2021 10:15:37 GMT
How absurdly wide are the streets of Silent Hill? Let's find out. Harry Mason seems to be an average size human male, using an average human male pace I'm getting 16.5 Metres or approximately 54.1 Ft. That's enough for a four lane dual carriageway with a central reservation based on UK standard road widths. I was on a forum once where someone was trying to determine how fast the Far Cry 3 protagonist could run 100m.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2021 10:20:17 GMT
Silent Hill is one of those games that really shit me up when I was younger. I remember getting on with it just fine up until I hit the school location and then the grimy, oppressive, nightmarish atmosphere really hit me. That bloody static on the radio and the sounds of babies crying made me want to crawl into a corner. I borrowed a magazine from a school mate with a complete guide to the game and grudgingly powered through it over a single weekend. I was relieved when it was all over and vowed to never to play it again, that's how much of an effect it had on me. To this day I haven't played it again and actually didn't (foolishly) play any other Silent Hill games either. I know I would enjoy them now! Silent Hill 2 & 3 are still absolute masterpieces that stand up well today. Incidentally, I played Silent Hill 2 on the PS2 and also the HD version on the XBox One last year and... Look, the HD one isn't great, everyone knows that, but it is surprisingly playable. So you should play SH2 & 3 asap, even if it's the HD ones.
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 4, 2021 11:24:20 GMT
There's definitely something oppressive about the first Silent Hill, each of the earlier games builds it's own atmosphere. There's something rather harsh and abrasive about the original. Under the original director, Yamoaka's soundscape is much more restrained, a lot of the time it's silence punctuated by unsettling drones leaving the environmental sounds at the forefront.
Enemies are a real handful, often because of the controls, unless you devote a lot of time to 90s games you'll be totally out of practice with tank controls. They can be a real challenge in Silent Hill which has lots of wide open spaces with an extremely mobile enemy type who can attack from any side, I wish I'd started on normal difficulty.
I've heard survival horror purists maintain that Silent Hill games should only have tank controls. I'd say it's the opposite the game only has a fixed camera for a fraction of the time, it's too unlike Resident Evil for it to work comfortably, Resident Evil is all tight environments with limited pathways and slow enemies so even today, playing something like RE Remake isn't too much trouble for the average person.
About an hour in you're reaching the school, there have been no jump scares and little in the way of gore set-pieces but the atmosphere just starts getting to you, this is a place you don't want to be. The enemies may be crude masses of polygons but you don't want to be anywhere near them, the radio static and drone start to drive you to paranoia. You can barely see but now you've got to turn off the flashlight too, it's drawing them in. Near blind in the dark with static telling you you're not alone you pray the door ahead isn't locked whilst also dreading what may be on the other side.
Even after all these years it still works.
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malek86
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Post by malek86 on Oct 4, 2021 11:58:59 GMT
The big problem with most early 3D survival horrors is that they rely on the controls being shit. If you could move these characters like a person moves in real life, those slow zombies and monsters wouldn't stand a chance of actually catching you. That's why the camera movement option in RE2 N64 makes the game super easy. Later survival horrors take that into account, so they can still be pretty challenging even when you aren't using tank controls.
Regarding Silent Hill in particular, I gotta say that SH3 was great. I never liked SH2 that much (probably because I played it several years after release), its themes might have been great but underneath it was more short adventure with crappy puzzles than survival horror. SH3 went back to the basics and was better for it imho.
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 4, 2021 12:25:41 GMT
Unfortunately the outdoor enemies in the original Silent Hill are not slow at all. The Dogs can be outrun eventually if you're not cornered or in a tight space but the flying enemies can match your speed, swoop over your head into fog or darkness and seem to be coded to blindside you. If you do hit them they'll often retreat, sometimes hide and then return to blindside you again.
Since running leads to dealing with multiple enemies I don't think it's just the tank controls that are challenging, team Silent built the game for an audience that had been using them for years. As I'm playing I realise I should have pulled out one of my original copies so I could read the manual, it's strictly old school with little in the way of tutorial or instruction, there's no 'cut off their limbs' here.
I recall now that the game has hidden stealth mechanics and you need to be aware of things like how much noise you're making.
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malek86
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Post by malek86 on Oct 4, 2021 13:43:14 GMT
I finished SH1 many years ago, but I seem to remember it wasn't too hard. Sure, it was a lot harder than SH2, but what isn't? That said, it's been so long that I'm not really sure. I should play it again this month, if I can make some free time in my backlog. A shame that it's never been ported to any other platforms, I'll have to play on the trusty old PSP.
If we wanna talk difficult survival horrors, then Siren needs to make the list, although not necessarily in a good way.
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