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Post by Warrender on Jul 10, 2023 10:34:02 GMT
Sidequests have taken a lot of flak. While most of them, to be fair, are pretty much go here/kill this; there are some fairly substantial side stories with multiple parts to them. Some of them are really quite good and add to the game's world in a meaningful way. Having finished the game, I think the sidequests add weight to the game's story. If you rush through to finish without doing them, I fear you might not like or enjoy the game as much. I think that's why Skill Up had his negative review. Of course, I did all the side quests as my OCD would not allow me to progress the main story until I did every single bloody one that popped up. |
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Post by pierrepressure on Jul 10, 2023 10:34:32 GMT
I'm enjoying my time with the game so far but I really really would like the old fashioned map to run around in. I like the mystery of finding places and visiting areas you perhaps shouldn't be.
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Post by richyroo on Jul 10, 2023 10:35:05 GMT
I don't really know what my problem is. It's objectively a great game. You could easily argue it's the most competent single player one since the golden era. I'll tell you one small thing I have missed since the old days - the sense of a journey. ...The newer games are all built around the idea of fast travel from the get go; even based around a hub in this one.
Definitely agree with you there. The amount of times the game just cuts back to the map, you choose the next location and BANG, you are right there.
It reminds me of the last 2 seasons of Game of Thrones where the characters suddenly teleported to their next destination instead of spending a whole season traveling there. It can be quite jarring at times. As I mentioned before, there really is no point exploring in this game.
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Psiloc
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Post by Psiloc on Jul 10, 2023 10:35:32 GMT
Actually that reminds me. Why aren't more people moaning about the lack of a minimap! It's really irritating me  |
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Post by richyroo on Jul 10, 2023 10:37:08 GMT
Because the maps are small enough and you only need to follow the waypoint to your next destination, its impossible to get lost and there is no point trying to explore! What do you think you need a minimap for exactly?
If you do get lost, a quick look at the map and you are right on your way again.
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Post by richyroo on Jul 10, 2023 10:47:08 GMT
Sidequests have taken a lot of flak. While most of them, to be fair, are pretty much go here/kill this; there are some fairly substantial side stories with multiple parts to them. Some of them are really quite good and add to the game's world in a meaningful way. Having finished the game, I think the sidequests add weight to the game's story. If you rush through to finish without doing them, I fear you might not like or enjoy the game as much. I think that's why Skill Up had his negative review. Of course, I did all the side quests as my OCD would not allow me to progress the main story until I did every single bloody one that popped up.
Somewhat agree. They are hit and miss for me.
Some of them have a very "human" element to them, much more so than say FFVII Remake which had some of the worst side quests I have played. At least in this they make you care more for the characters and add to the overall lore and world building which can be great. One I particularly liked was very dark in tone and revolved around how poorly the bearers were treated. Side quests like this really added something meaningful to the game.
Other times, they can be simple fetch quests and quite tedious.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Jul 10, 2023 10:50:50 GMT
I feel the game would have benefitted simply by having each area interconnect with each other at the end of zones, FFX style. You could technically do the same sort of 'walk' from one end of the map to the other as you could in FFX but the way it cuts over to a world map whenever you exit every zone immediately makes it feel more 'gamey' and isolated.
I also don't like how, as has become tradition in Final Fantasy games now, bigger cities are completely sidestepped even though they exist in the world. It's a testament to the game's story, voice acting and cutscenes that I care at all about what's going on, as the locations that are supposedly at stake in the game's world are completely absent other than a cutscene here or there.
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Psiloc
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Post by Psiloc on Jul 10, 2023 11:00:19 GMT
Perhaps it's just me, but I use minimaps as an alternative to pressing the map button
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Post by JuniorFE on Jul 10, 2023 11:08:03 GMT
Honestly, the more (non-spoiler) stuff I hear/read about the game, the less I understand why they didn't just go full action with it... (possibly unpopular opinions ahead, spoilered to avoid clutter) Levelling up giving fixed boosts is okay, you don't have to have a Soulsborne "choose your stat on every level" system to be an RPG, but no element system in a game with so much focus on the Eikons/bearers? (I'm not asking for anything complicated either, just "literal fireball doesn't take the same damage from fire and ice" 😅) Barely any buffs/debuffs?
Not a single alternative weapon type? Equipment/crafting being so barebones? (Which isn't helped by the lack of elements/buffs, those alone would have opened the door for much more variety on weapons/armour... Elemental weapons situationally being better than a stronger non-elemental weapon, a weapon being very powerful in exchange for poisoning you or something...)
Barely any exploration/side areas? The majority of sidequests lacking in gameplay (as good as they are for fleshing out the story)? Feels like it would have been better if they just went all-in on the action, DMC-style (as they clearly wanted to already) and fleshed out the already good battle system even more instead of trying to add half-baked RPG elements for the sake of it being a Final Fantasy (or, if they were worried it would deviate from being an FF too much at that point, instead flesh their RPG systems out a bit for goodness' sake ) |
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Post by starchildhypocrethes on Jul 10, 2023 11:11:39 GMT
The lack of scale and exploration in the areas impacts on the side quests a fair bit too.
Having someone tell you that such and such has been missing for days and they’re so worried about them, only to walk 50yds and see them perched on a rock in full view of a lookout, is pretty dumb.
Or another where someone needs some wood, it’s a matter of life or death that they get, pleeeeeease help. And the wood is in a room next door.
It’s all just a bit half-arsed at times.
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Post by Wizzard_Ook on Jul 10, 2023 11:18:10 GMT
I kind of wish I had more of a break from TOTK before starting this. It’s strong pacing in the first act (I’m doing the last mission in that act at the moment)carried me for a good while -15 odd hours, but as soon as it’s started to open up a bit I feel like i had the wind sucked out of me- I’ve played xenoblade 3 and Horizon FW on top of the new Zelda this year and i don’t think I got the stomach for more of it at the moment. Kind of want to put it on pause - because I gently enjoyed what I have played so far yet don’t want to forgot everything and start again. Twat.
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Psiloc
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Post by Psiloc on Jul 10, 2023 11:20:11 GMT
I kind of wish I had more of a break from TOTK before starting this. It’s strong pacing in the first act (I’m doing the last mission in that act at the moment)carried me for a good while -15 odd hours, but as soon as it’s started to open up a bit I feel like i had the wind sucked out of me- I’ve played xenoblade 3 and Horizon FW on top of the new Zelda this year and i don’t think I got the stomach for more of it at the moment. Kind of want to put it on pause - because I gently enjoyed what I have played so far yet don’t want to forgot everything and start again. Twat. Maybe this is my problem too |
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Post by Tuffty on Jul 10, 2023 11:30:54 GMT
Its a hard thing to balance when it comes to side quests and ensure its enjoyable and rewarding. With FFXVI they ask you to go here to fight this monster or deliver these 3 things so how would it make them better by asking you, the player, to spend say 5-10 mins traversing to the destination to do it and complete the objective in less time? The worst aspect of AC Valhalla is that you spend more time travelling within a side quest to reach a destination rather than actually engaging in what the side quest expects of you and that game is plagued with hundreds of sidequests like that.
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Post by Humperfunk on Jul 10, 2023 12:01:22 GMT
Fuck me these sidequests are shit.
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Post by richyroo on Jul 10, 2023 12:12:44 GMT
Fuck me these sidequests are shit.
I do appreciate a non-ambiguous comment.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Jul 10, 2023 12:24:06 GMT
The earlier sidequests don't do a lot of justice to the later ones. There are some much meatier ones with proper bosses and the like later on.
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Post by richyroo on Jul 10, 2023 12:50:28 GMT
Ok, my mini-review after 75% completion. 6/10 - Gameplay & Fighting System (a little basic) 3/10 - RPG Elements (very thin, barely there) 4/10 - Equipment & Items Systems (may as well not of bothered) 1/10 - Party System (doesn't exist) 3/10 - Exploration (pointless) 10/10 - World building and lore (incredible, especially if used in conjunction with the active lore system). 9/10 - Story and characters (so far very good. The most invested I have been in any mainline FF game) 10/10 - Overall spectacle (I'm aghast at some of the stuff happening on screen sometimes)
To me, this is a game that you experience more than you actually play. For this it wont be for everyone and I understand that, especially if you are after a typical Final Fantasy style game. Personally however, I cannot put the thing down.
Final Fantasy is dead. Long live Final Fantasy.
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Jul 10, 2023 12:59:21 GMT
I think they gave enough warning that this was going to be an action game that it's a bit harsh to judge it on being a traditional FF game or RPG. Yakuza did the opposite switch with Like a Dragon and that made a similarly excellent series shift. It's a different game now and the quality has largely matched the ambition. If FF games are like this in the future then the series is absolutely fine going this way.
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Post by The12thMonkey on Jul 10, 2023 13:07:15 GMT
I landed in 8/10 territory, mainly because of the impact the story and worlbuilding had on me, along with the battle system.
With some games it can be easy to imagine what the design decisions were from the end product, because they all mesh toegther so well. Those sorts of games are commnunicating their design so clearly. But in this it feel so hard to even speculate what the thinking was behind things like the gearing and crafting (yeah, I know I made a cheap gag about EG's review on that point, and I'm happy to admit this part of the review was pretty spot on). Those systems just feel so tacked on.
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Post by Wizzard_Ook on Jul 16, 2023 19:59:46 GMT
I think they gave enough warning that this was going to be an action game that it's a bit harsh to judge it on being a traditional FF game or RPG. Yakuza did the opposite switch with Like a Dragon and that made a similarly excellent series shift. It's a different game now and the quality has largely matched the ambition. If FF games are like this in the future then the series is absolutely fine going this way. Talking of Yakuza, the cutscenes in this remind me a lot of those games. They’re really well done. That’s a pretty big compliment because I think when it comes to writing, characterisation, and panache, they’re probably best in class. |
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Jul 16, 2023 20:08:02 GMT
Finally finished this yesterday (62hours!) and I'm pleased to say it didn't do a FFXV in the latter half. Also the later sidequests are absolutely not to be missed, they are far more meaningful to the game's world than just filler content.
The only bit of minor criticism I could throw at it, is that there's a moment in the game that never gets topped with anything after it. That's not to say the rest isn't good, it's very good, but I kept waiting for the 'next step up' and nothing ever quite matched up to it.
I'd be fully on board with Eikons: The Game if they did it. Some of the best set pieces in any games ever.
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Post by Tuffty on Jul 17, 2023 6:56:19 GMT
Got to a part in the story last night that I guess I didn't like How the fuck did Wade survive the explosion? Hes right there with Joshua when it happened. You can argue a case where he does survive, but surely you show that he has massive burns over his body. If GOT was the inspiration I feel like that would have happened and Wade could still be a leader of the resistance but very much in the shadows because hes racked with constantly. But to show him there, very much untouched, its a bit wild. Clive should be asking these questions for the audiences sake. Maybe they'll come back to it later and it is minor in the context of the wider story but it only serves to further undercut the impact of the opening. It is funny to see them following the 14 style of narrative where there's massive budget being shown on screen for these huge moments and in the aftermath of what follows the budget is most def scaled down. Its like the post expansion patches seen in 14. I dont mind it, I'm used to it from 14 |
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Post by richyroo on Jul 17, 2023 6:59:58 GMT
While I like the Active Lore System, a few times now it has mentioned events that haven't actually happened in game yet and revealed spoilers.
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Tuffty
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Post by Tuffty on Jul 17, 2023 7:09:13 GMT
While I like the Active Lore System, a few times now it has mentioned events that haven't actually happened in game yet and revealed spoilers. Related to my post above, it even gives away whether or not characters definitively died or not. I saw it reading through latest lore entries and for some characters it will say they died but the one I mentioned didn't have that against them. Guess if the latest lore entry doesn't mention it, then it's fair game. I think for the first implementation it's 95% ok and doing a good job, but yeh maybe too descriptive sometimes lol |
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Post by richyroo on Jul 17, 2023 9:19:41 GMT
While I like the Active Lore System, a few times now it has mentioned events that haven't actually happened in game yet and revealed spoilers. Related to my post above, it even gives away whether or not characters definitively died or not. I saw it reading through latest lore entries and for some characters it will say they died but the one I mentioned didn't have that against them. Guess if the latest lore entry doesn't mention it, then it's fair game. I think for the first implementation it's 95% ok and doing a good job, but yeh maybe too descriptive sometimes lol
Yep, last night I was reading up on one of the characters and it mentioned "...after they died". I thought to myself, hang on, I haven't killed them yet. Well I guess I know that is inevitable now.
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Post by richyroo on Jul 17, 2023 9:22:34 GMT
How do you add a spoiler tag?
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Post by One_Vurfed_Gwrx on Jul 17, 2023 10:32:35 GMT
Related to my post above, it even gives away whether or not characters definitively died or not. I saw it reading through latest lore entries and for some characters it will say they died but the one I mentioned didn't have that against them. Guess if the latest lore entry doesn't mention it, then it's fair game. I think for the first implementation it's 95% ok and doing a good job, but yeh maybe too descriptive sometimes lol
Yep, last night I was reading up on one of the characters and it mentioned "...after they died". I thought to myself, hang on, I haven't killed them yet. Well I guess I know that is inevitable now.
I saw that one, it was pretty obvious but still out of order. That was the only noticably bad one I have caught and I am approaching the end I believe. |
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Post by richyroo on Jul 17, 2023 10:40:37 GMT
Yep, last night I was reading up on one of the characters and it mentioned "...after they died". I thought to myself, hang on, I haven't killed them yet. Well I guess I know that is inevitable now.
I saw that one, it was pretty obvious but still out of order. That was the only noticably bad one I have caught and I am approaching the end I believe.
Yeah I am approaching the end too, so likely the same person we are thinking of.
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Post by Humperfunk on Jul 17, 2023 21:58:07 GMT
Just finished the main story, Have done all side quests and hunts until the final load that unlocked toward the end and will go back to finish.
58 hours on the clock according to the PS5 and will obviously reflect on it, but immediate reaction is fucking hell that was great. I've made comments about it not being a good "Final Fantasy" game but am now fully on board with a) it is and b) what is a good "final Fantasy" game anyway?
Those boss fights, absolutely incredible. Every single one had me out of my seat and proper punching the air wildly when dealing the last blow, the fact the game evoked that reaction in me speaks volumes.
Soundtrack is amazing, great performances and a deep, captivating story. Well done Square Enix, FF is back.
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Post by richyroo on Jul 20, 2023 16:00:17 GMT
I finished the main story last night. I have mixed feelings.
The initial opening 2 hours (as per the demo) were definitely the highlight for me. Intrigue, backstabbing etc, it was great. Unfortunately the game couldn't keep this up throughout.
I mostly enjoyed this up to the end 25% from when it lost its way a bit. I still enjoyed the main missions, but I absolutely hated the side quests. Leading up to the end game, there were so many side quests to complete. Last night I ended up spending about 2 hours on side quests, 90% of that time was watching cutscenes, I just became really dis-interested that I started browsing on my tablet while listening in the background. In the end I ditched the remaining side quests (about 3 or 4) and just went straight into the final mission.
1st half of the game I would give a 10/10.
2nd half of the game I would give a 7/10.
Side quests really drag the game down and gets a 4/10.
Overall its probably an 8/10 from me, but if I ever replay it then I will just stick to the main missions and have a blast.
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