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Post by gamingdave on Oct 17, 2024 16:17:41 GMT
A game doesn't really offer a fixed 'value', if you play for twenty minutes, lose interest and never play again, how much is that worth? Sure, if the stars align it could work out that you got entertained for the price of £1 per hour if you spend 60-70 hours playing. Overall video games are already massively overpriced, £30 should be the top end for physical and digital should always be significantly less. What if you leave a cinema early? Or you buy a book and put it down? Or you go for a fancy meal and it's not as nice as you expected? Value, on a personal level, can be thought of as benefit vs cost. That could be enjoyment (either as a single experience or repeated use) like an album, game, DVD/BR, or book. It could be utility like a coffee machine, or nicer car. Clothing can fall in between. If you pick the enjoyment option and compare games with other forms of entertainment just on price, well in London that could easily be £7 per hour for the cinema. A gig might be less than £20 for a small band, but top acts are over £100 and often play for less than 2hrs, so that's £50 per hour. So on price/time, gaming is frequently cheaper than other "entertainment" (plus can be resold after to reduce the cost). But then you have to assess the quality of those hours too. Some hours will be more memorable too, that (to me at least) adds value. The value is what you and only you get out of it, and it depends how much you value different types of entertainment and experiences. So a £70 game you play for an hour and don't enjoy probably equals bad value. A £70 game you play most weekends with the kids (in our house thats Mario Karts and Mario Party) would look like excellent value. Since installing Balatro on my phone I've played over 40 hours, so it's worked out less than 25p an hour. But like I said it's all relative and value can only be measured by your perception of it. |
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 17, 2024 16:51:20 GMT
If they don't offer a fixed value then why should there be a £30 cap? To be fair I've only spent more than that a few times in the last 10 years, and generally regretted it, so maybe you're right...
I'd prefer to pay less, the publisher meanwhile wants to squeeze us for every Penny. £30 is meeting them half way, a reasonable price that both sides can live with.
Incidentally that was the regular price for PS1 games back in the day, and I had an N64 my games often cost double that. That was painful.
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Post by Bill in the rain on Oct 18, 2024 1:53:19 GMT
If they don't offer a fixed value then why should there be a £30 cap? To be fair I've only spent more than that a few times in the last 10 years, and generally regretted it, so maybe you're right...
I'd prefer to pay less, the publisher meanwhile wants to squeeze us for every Penny. £30 is meeting them half way, a reasonable price that both sides can live with.
Incidentally that was the regular price for PS1 games back in the day, and I had an N64 my games often cost double that. That was painful.
30 quid back in 1995 would be about 60 quid in modern money though. Not that I can comment, as my brain is still stuck in UK circa 2000 prices so 60 quid for a game sounds insane to me. That's like 120 pints!  |
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Cappy
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Post by Cappy on Oct 18, 2024 8:00:44 GMT
I'd prefer to pay less, the publisher meanwhile wants to squeeze us for every Penny. £30 is meeting them half way, a reasonable price that both sides can live with.
Incidentally that was the regular price for PS1 games back in the day, and I had an N64 my games often cost double that. That was painful.
30 quid back in 1995 would be about 60 quid in modern money though. Not that I can comment, as my brain is still stuck in UK circa 2000 prices so 60 quid for a game sounds insane to me. That's like 120 pints! That's in 1990s screwing us for every Penny money though. They were trying it on then too, PS1 games for a brief period cost more. |
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Post by dfunked on Oct 18, 2024 8:12:38 GMT
Saw an article about the upcoming Clair Obscur being suspiciously cheap at $50 instead of the usual $70 and had to laugh.
That's still not cheap!
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Post by Vandelay on Oct 18, 2024 8:15:42 GMT
Certainly on PC, games were £30 for ages. Pretty much from the 90s up to about 10 years ago, most would be that price, with maybe a few creeping up to £40. It's only really in recent years that they have started ramping up in price. I do bulk at a new game being £60-70 and recently I have been dipping into CD Keys on PC to get them for £30-40 instead. Equally though, I appreciate that these games cost a fucking ton to produce and they have to pay for them some how. If it is a game I'm really interested in, then paying £50+ doesn't seem that unreasonable, particularly compared to he cost of other entertainment. I do think that the cost of making games is the biggest problem the industry has. Dedicating 100s of people for 5+ years on a project is bound to end up with companies teetering on the edge of mega success or absolute failure with every release. And there is clearly a market for smaller games, as the biggest success stories are often games made by small teams aand using simple technology. Just seems madness that the big publishers only seem interested in throwing all their eggs in one big basket that has a massive hole in the bottom. On a similar note, thought this article about Paradox's reaction to the failure of The Lamplighter League interesting. Completely unable to think critically about their own failings and instead just blame the market and claim that the turn-based tactics genre only has room for X-Com. www.rockpapershotgun.com/paradox-think-theres-no-point-competing-with-xcom-after-their-lamplighters-flop-its-winner-takes-all-in-the-tactical-gaming-space |
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Post by zisssou on Oct 18, 2024 8:21:31 GMT
A lot of games tank in price after 3-4 months anyway. Is this not a case of I want it now and can't wait?
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Post by Bill in the rain on Oct 18, 2024 8:44:15 GMT
Pretty sure I paid 49.99 for Tie Fighter's Collector's CD-ROM from HMV back in the day.
But back then I bought about 3 games a year, and had a lot more free time and disposable income.
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Post by zisssou on Oct 18, 2024 8:51:17 GMT
I mean I get the conversation, as I've been part of it for years. I don't want to pay £60-70. But if it is a game I'm really itching to play, then I'll pay it. I think I paid £55 for Silent Hill 2, which is probably £5 more than I would like.
In the end you are the master of your own wallet. With the amount of subscriptions, cheap sales, more games are available than ever.
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rftp
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Post by rftp on Oct 18, 2024 9:06:01 GMT
Yup. I can afford to pay £60 for Silent Hill and even more for Outlaws, but I'm not desperate to play them and I'm positive that both will be available for £30 odd each in a few months anyway. Or on PS+ (as were both Crusader Kings and Mount and Blade immediately after I bought them!).
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Bongo Heracles
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Post by Bongo Heracles on Oct 18, 2024 10:12:29 GMT
Yup, the cost of games has stopped me buying them on release. 49.99 and I may have bitten on Wo Long, Stellar Blade and a few others but at 69.99 I’m more than happy to wait for a sale. I just grabbed armoured core for 35 and I’m relatively happy with that.
Like you say, I can afford it (braggable) but for something that’s going to be one and done I don’t really consider most things good value at 70 quid.
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Tomo
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Post by Tomo on Oct 18, 2024 10:26:26 GMT
Can't remember the last game I bought at full price. Baldur's Gate 3 maybe?
I don't really blame the industry for setting prices as high as £70. As many others have said, they games can have enormous dev teams and marketing budgets nowadays. There are far, far too many games out there for me feel enough pull for me to buy something on launch day when it'll significantly drop in price a month or two later.
If games held their value for longer, I would probably be stumping up £70 for a game. I'd just buy a lot fewer each year.
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Post by Jambowayoh on Oct 18, 2024 10:36:35 GMT
I suppose that's how Nintendo has got people by the balls with how rarely their games go on sale if ever.
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Bongo Heracles
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Post by Bongo Heracles on Oct 18, 2024 10:56:35 GMT
Tbf, they do. They don’t give them away, sure, but a lot of them regularly go down to like 33 quid or something.
But, to my point, I’ve actually bought more Nintendo games on release recently because they are generally still below 50 quid.
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Post by zisssou on Oct 18, 2024 10:58:25 GMT
Tbf, they do. They don’t give them away, sure, but a lot of them regularly go down to like 33 quid or something. But, to my point, I’ve actually bought more Nintendo games on release recently because they are generally still below 50 quid. Currys have been fairly decent with releasing new Switch games at below £40. |
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Post by Bill in the rain on Oct 18, 2024 11:02:41 GMT
Back when I paid 50 for Tie Fighter it sat on the shelf at HMV for about a year, and I stared longingly at it every time I went before I finally caved and bought it. Price never changed.
These days games (except nintendo) drop so fast, that If the hype/fomo doesn't push me to buy it in the firs week or so, then I'll probably just end up holding off until it's dirt cheap.
Case in point, I really wanted to get the new System Shock when you guys were playing it, but I never quite got around to it. I'm sure I'd love it and it'd be worth the money. Now that initial phase has passed, and it's on the discount slope, so there's no real pressure to buy it until I'm actually going to play it, which can be anytime.
But pricing games high for people who are willing to pay for that initial phase, and then discounting them for others after, seems to make economic sense. It's the same way all those F2P games work, getting most of their money off a few whales.
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Post by technoish on Oct 18, 2024 11:21:14 GMT
PC game prices are surely also more subject to devaluation because of piracy? So you price a little lower to reduce people just stealing it.
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apollo
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Post by apollo on Oct 18, 2024 11:21:41 GMT
The amount of the principal skinner meme of "am so out of touch..." in that article from Paradox is funny as I played it on gamepass at launch and after the final patch and the game was broken and very buggy at launch but it was not a good game. it was not well made and this is from the shadowrun studio (not sure how many remain from the shadowrun games days)
To say the turn-based tactics genre only has room for X-Com, is such bullshit. There is other xcom type games from small studios that are doing better. When publishers lie this blatantly, its another state of industry problem. |
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Post by technoish on Oct 18, 2024 11:22:44 GMT
Xbox game pass has really reduced my day 1 purchases. Seeing as I don't even end up playing the free day 1 releases I realised I should just play what I want when I want to. Not just because it's released! Although I do miss the day 1 discussions etc that I got from e.g. Destiny release.
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apollo
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Post by apollo on Oct 18, 2024 11:28:49 GMT
talking of gamepass, Mechwarrior clans was added few days ago and its unoptimized and buggy mess on PC and xbox (not sure it is on ps5) read its even overheating series s consoles!
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Post by Jambowayoh on Oct 18, 2024 11:37:20 GMT
PC game prices are surely also more subject to devaluation because of piracy? So you price a little lower to reduce people just stealing it. I don't believe piracy has had a massive effect on sales really in the PC space, there are some people who comment that they pirate to try it out which doesn't really fly in the age of how easy it is to refund on Steam. The people who pirate were never going to buy it anyway and generally never do usually because of finances. |
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Tuffty
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Post by Tuffty on Oct 18, 2024 11:48:11 GMT
Sony games lately definitely do not come down in price especially on the ps store. Ace Combat 7 was £50, I got a new copy from Amazon for less than £10. There's a stigma around Ubisoft that they can't shake which is that it's not worth buying games on release because there's the expectation a more bug free version of the game, with more content, for cheaper in a year or so.
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Post by zisssou on Oct 18, 2024 11:55:01 GMT
I would agree that games that are older on digital stores, need to be comparative to that of a physical game. I know for certain that Ace Combat 7 was £10 in the recent summer sale, but then it has been jacked up like you've just mentioned.
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Post by BeetrootBertie on Oct 18, 2024 12:01:34 GMT
I think Nintendo generally strike a good balance in that their first party games seem to retain value, but they don't flood each gen with constant sequels. If you get the current Mario Kart, there's a feeling that there won't be another in a year's time.
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Post by Jambowayoh on Oct 18, 2024 12:02:45 GMT
I don't think they got the memo about Mario Party.
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zagibu
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Post by zagibu on Oct 18, 2024 12:09:11 GMT
The amount of the principal skinner meme of "am so out of touch..." in that article from Paradox is funny as I played it on gamepass at launch and after the final patch and the game was broken and very buggy at launch but it was not a good game. it was not well made and this is from the shadowrun studio (not sure how many remain from the shadowrun games days)
To say the turn-based tactics genre only has room for X-Com, is such bullshit. There is other xcom type games from small studios that are doing better. When publishers lie this blatantly, its another state of industry problem. It's not just that. It could also have flopped if it was a good game. Lots of good games flop. The deduction they make is frankly insane. |
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Aunty Treats
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Post by Aunty Treats on Oct 18, 2024 12:11:33 GMT
Nintendo games aren't actually £70 on release, are they? More like £50 or £60, plus you can do the buy 2 games for £80 thing and they don't do lame collector/ultimate/deluxe/early access stuff as far as I know and I don't think the MTX on first party are that bad either
I'm more inclined to buy a Nintendo game at release because they're just selling me a game and their quality control is usually very good
Indies I'll happily pay £20 - £30 for if I really want to play them
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apollo
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Post by apollo on Oct 18, 2024 12:15:21 GMT
the amount of old games on console shop store with really high prices is crap. Just example I saw today, Dirt 5 is leaving gamepass (no doubt EA is turning off the servers) and the sale price is £43.99 with RRP of 54.99 or the one for all the DLC for 59.99 with RRP of 74.99. You can say "so fuckin what dirt 5 is shit" Its example of games on digital store on console that have almost day 1 prices still years after the launch and there is other examples. Even with keys from legit sites, the prices for downloads for old games can be taking the piss as physical media is going the way of the dinosaur
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zephro
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Post by zephro on Oct 18, 2024 12:16:52 GMT
I'd prefer to pay less, the publisher meanwhile wants to squeeze us for every Penny. £30 is meeting them half way, a reasonable price that both sides can live with.
Incidentally that was the regular price for PS1 games back in the day, and I had an N64 my games often cost double that. That was painful.
30 quid back in 1995 would be about 60 quid in modern money though. Not that I can comment, as my brain is still stuck in UK circa 2000 prices so 60 quid for a game sounds insane to me. That's like 120 pints! Where the fuck were you drinking in 2000? Also weren't N64 games £60 in the 90s? Admittedly it was the last proper cartridge system. |
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Aunty Treats
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Post by Aunty Treats on Oct 18, 2024 12:20:38 GMT
the amount of old games on console shop store with really high prices is crap. Just example I saw today, Dirt 5 is leaving gamepass (no doubt EA is turning off the servers) and the sale price is £43.99 with RRP of 54.99 or the one for all the DLC for 59.99 with RRP of 74.99. You can say "so fuckin what dirt 5 is shit" Its example of games on digital store on console that have almost day 1 prices still years after the launch and there is other examples. Even with keys from legit sites, the prices for downloads for old games can be taking the piss as physical media is going the way of the dinosaur It's all about the sales tho
I imagine keeping the prices that high gets them some serious dough from silly people and makes the sale prices look a lot more enticing
If your game is always cheap, people will be much less likely to panic buy it in a sale, just in case the price doesn't come down that low again (for a while)
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