Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 9:44:10 GMT
Bottas with an engine change now. Merc are having a nightmare at these tracks they have an advantage at between driver error and now this.
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Post by Red_Bool on Sept 26, 2021 9:46:40 GMT
Merc making sure Max won't get through turn 1 😉
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 9:49:45 GMT
Actually, yeah. I completely forgot Max skipped quali so he'll still start P20 and behind Bottas. So they've changed the engine purely to hold him up. Wow.
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Post by damagedinc on Sept 26, 2021 9:53:05 GMT
Redbull winning the mind games arnt they, quite amusing how they've really got under mercs skin.
I want Lewis to win but I'm kind of suprised how much merc dropped the ball this season. Guess that's what you get when you have nearly a decade of no one really pushing you. So fair play to redbull turning the screw this season.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 9:56:59 GMT
It's been funny watching them act holier than thou for the last 7 years only to completely contradict themselves as soon as someone steps up to their level (like they claimed they really wanted).
What a low move. It almost makes breaking the seal on Massa's gearbox look acceptable.
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 26, 2021 10:02:00 GMT
Pretty smart from Merc in my opinion. I think Bottas was always going to need to take another penalty anyway as he smashed up one car at Imola and another one at the Hungaroring. Should be well set to the end of the season now.
Given he was 7th on the grid, the constructor's championship situation, and the fact that both RBs are compromised, it's actually pretty sensible. Bottas can start on hards under orders to keep Max behind, and if it's possible to come through whilst essentially covering whatever pit strategy Max does, it's a nice bonus.
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 26, 2021 10:04:26 GMT
Of course if Bottas didn't need more components in his pool then this is a lot more cynical. I genuinely don't know which is the case, but I had in my head that Bottas was two engines and/or gearboxes down this season so the one grid penalty he's taken wasn't sufficient.
I don't think taking the penalty makes any strategic sense at all if he didn't need the components?
Why would Bottas be any more likely to prevent Max scoring points by finishing in front of him starting 17th than 7th? I don't believe for a second that Bottas will be told to do anything other than "try and score as many points as you can and don't let Max overtake you". Isn't that the exact same game plan as at every grand prix?
Bottas starting lower down also doesn't relegate Max any further back or promote Lewis higher up either. The only material benefit is the new components.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 10:09:02 GMT
Mercedes have openly admitted it's a tactical move. Honestly, when I posted before I genuinely thought they'd had some terrible luck because no one would be so shameless. Apparently not.
Poor Bottas. A tool to be used 'til the end.
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 26, 2021 10:14:35 GMT
I edited my above post after thinking about it more, before I saw your reply.
Are you sure they meant tactical in a 'fuck over Max way' and not in the exact same way that Red Bull, are taking a 'tactical' penalty i.e. it's a good time to minimise the damage by bringing a likely grid penalty forward?
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 26, 2021 10:26:16 GMT
Hypothetically, if the entire game plan for Bottas is 'block Max' as is being suggested, surely that's actually much harder starting only just ahead of him than 13 places ahead of him. Starting P17, Max will likely be in undercut range before the first stops, whereas it would be much easier to guarantee Max couldn't undercut him with plenty of cars in between. It also makes it way more likely that Max could get him at the start before T2.
Bottas could have started P7, 'accidentally' taken the escape route at T1 at some point and dropped down the order to do the blocking job with much more margin for error available. Starting P17 just makes it harder to engineer an ideal blocking situation to stop Max getting points. Logically, the theory that it's mainly about blocking Max doesn't make any sense.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 10:31:26 GMT
They are quite obviously doing it to try and hold up Max. We can dress it up however we want but that's what they are doing.
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Post by TheSaint on Sept 26, 2021 11:40:08 GMT
Logically, the theory that it's mainly about blocking Max doesn't make any sense. It does if you are an anti-Hamilton/Mercedes nutter.
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 26, 2021 11:45:46 GMT
Yeah but that's normal. Get in front, don't let the others by, especially direct championship rivals. That's literally what racing is. It's what Bottas was supposed to do in France and in Holland and failed miserably at.
Doesn't change the fact that taking a grid penalty probably makes it harder for him to finish in front of Max rather than easier. Let's at least see what happens and what the strategies are before assuming agent Bottas is out to do something unsporting rather than simply being Merc doing what every team does, and take engine penalties when they think it will incur the least overall damage to their championship.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 11:56:41 GMT
If he holds his charge during the first stint it's job done. He'll be completely out of sync with the people he'll be aiming to beat.
Of course having simple knowledge of how racing works in the current era makes me a nutter, and not just thick as pigshit like Saint.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 12:02:19 GMT
Yeah but that's normal. Get in front, don't let the others by, especially direct championship rivals. That's literally what racing is. It's what Bottas was supposed to do in France and in Holland and failed miserably at. Doesn't change the fact that taking a grid penalty probably makes it harder for him to finish in front of Max rather than easier. Let's at least see what happens and what the strategies are before assuming agent Bottas is out to do something unsporting rather than simply being Merc doing what every team does, and take engine penalties when they think it will incur the least overall damage to their championship. No one's assuming he's trying to do something shady like take him out. He's trying to hold him up during a very important first stint in the faster car on a track that's quite difficult to overtake. There's no point being willfully ignorant of what they are trying to do.
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Post by monkman5000 on Sept 26, 2021 12:04:08 GMT
Nervous for Lando
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 12:05:40 GMT
Breathless start. Jesus.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 12:08:12 GMT
Alonso has kept about 10 positions there going wide.
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Post by monkman5000 on Sept 26, 2021 12:09:39 GMT
Alonso has kept about 10 positions there going wide. Yeah totally, bit dodgy considering he even practised that move on the formation lap.
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 26, 2021 12:13:08 GMT
Alonso also said after Austria that he'd just do that in future.
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 26, 2021 12:14:07 GMT
Yeah but that's normal. Get in front, don't let the others by, especially direct championship rivals. That's literally what racing is. It's what Bottas was supposed to do in France and in Holland and failed miserably at. Doesn't change the fact that taking a grid penalty probably makes it harder for him to finish in front of Max rather than easier. Let's at least see what happens and what the strategies are before assuming agent Bottas is out to do something unsporting rather than simply being Merc doing what every team does, and take engine penalties when they think it will incur the least overall damage to their championship. No one's assuming he's trying to do something shady like take him out. He's trying to hold him up during a very important first stint in the faster car on a track that's quite difficult to overtake. There's no point being willfully ignorant of what they are trying to do. Well, Bottas is clearly going as fast as he can, so that theory was nonsense. Also Bottas is rubbish.
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Post by monkman5000 on Sept 26, 2021 12:14:17 GMT
Seems close, but like so many races this season it seems you need some ridiculous lap delta to get past the car in front. Another exciting procession, basically.
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Post by damagedinc on Sept 26, 2021 12:16:08 GMT
Haha bottas doesn't give a fuck
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Post by TheSaint on Sept 26, 2021 12:16:09 GMT
That’s why the conspiracy didn’t make any sense. Bottas is useless at holding Max up.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 12:16:47 GMT
It's not a conspiracy, it's tactics. Which failed.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 12:22:15 GMT
I can see these front 2 coming together here.
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Post by monkman5000 on Sept 26, 2021 12:26:32 GMT
Good work production team. That was only for first place.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 12:26:51 GMT
Shocking direction.
C'mon Lando. Scamper away.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 26, 2021 12:29:17 GMT
What are Mercedes playing at here?
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Post by starchildhypocrethes on Sept 26, 2021 12:32:03 GMT
I think the Mercedes race strategist must be stuck in the toilet or something.
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