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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 16:50:42 GMT
I guess at least the big winners, Red Bull and Williams, deserved a bit of luck.
Constantly being told we've had race after sitting here for hours feels like the FIA and Sky are attempting to gaslight the entire fan base of the sport.
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 16:55:48 GMT
I imagine Merc will be pretty gutted. As we saw in Portimao, they are usually the best at switching on cold tyres and would have had a great chance in a short sprint.
Fair play to Hamilton for alluding to the FIAs true motivations for the 2 laps in that interview and mentioning refunds!
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 29, 2021 16:58:58 GMT
Lewis obviously took inspiration from the toilet incident earlier to drop some bombs there.
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 17:04:32 GMT
So the F1 official Twitter account quoted Hamilton but left off the bit about refunds.
If that was genuinely the reason for forcing 2 laps, its pretty damning. Really shows where the priorities lie.
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Solid-SCB-
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 29, 2021 17:07:39 GMT
How can the premier Motorsport category on planet earth not have a contingency plan for this sort of thing? It's Sunday club amateur bullshit.
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 17:20:36 GMT
Hamilton now just directly accusing the FIA of forcing the running of two laps for money.
Good for him. I don't believe the FIA is biased in any way except to their commercial agreement penalty clauses.
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 29, 2021 17:23:29 GMT
Stepping away from the farce and onto the competitive standpoint, this might actually go some way to mitigating some of Red Bull's engine woes. It's one of the most demanding engine circuits and they've just got away with skipping it along with a few points. Will be interesting to see if this changes anything in regards to needing a 4th PU at some point this season.
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 17:25:03 GMT
Norris to Verstappen: "great race, unbelievable drive!", "I was catching you".
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 17:27:20 GMT
Stepping away from the farce and onto the competitive standpoint, this might actually go some way to mitigating some of Red Bull's engine woes. It's one of the most demanding engine circuits and they've just got away with skipping it along with a few points. Will be interesting to see if this changes anything in regards to needing a 4th PU at some point this season. Good point but did he lose another engine or gearbox after his crash on Friday as it's still a net loss is so. Don't think I've heard anything further on that one |
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 29, 2021 17:34:42 GMT
They have separate gearboxes for practice they can change freely, so would just be a cost cap issue with that. Didn't hear/know anything happened to that engine though. That would be a bit of a season killer.
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nazo
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Post by nazo on Aug 29, 2021 17:38:29 GMT
Perez should get the points for providing the only entertainment of the whole day.
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Post by jono62 on Aug 29, 2021 17:46:01 GMT
What the fuck is up with that accent? |
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 29, 2021 17:51:41 GMT
He's had that American twang since he started his big time music career.
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Post by damagedinc on Aug 29, 2021 20:05:43 GMT
Impossible to manage today, seems a bit harsh to provide points and a "race" with what was provided today and have no doubt it came down to money.
Lewis will be rightly pissed off as he would have at least got ahead of George. However the conditions the way they were any one of them could have gone off at any time so I think Lewis etc will be happy in hindsight just to get points.
As said above the fact there is no contingency for this kind of event is mad. Very rare occurance but this is poor.
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 20:15:40 GMT
Vettel also described awarding points as a joke.
Hamilton and Vettel really doing the elder statesman thing well. I thought Sky totally misjudged the tone by trying to defend the indefensible.
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 29, 2021 20:30:39 GMT
Imagine if this was the final round and the Championship decider.
I find it hard to believe they'd still prioritise the money because they'd rightly worry about the wider sporting and reputational damage. They did it today because they correctly assumed they'd just about get away with it mid season.
It's properly damaging to the integrity of the sport and heads should roll.
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Post by Dougs on Aug 30, 2021 7:43:32 GMT
So the F1 official Twitter account quoted Hamilton but left off the bit about refunds. If that was genuinely the reason for forcing 2 laps, its pretty damning. Really shows where the priorities lie. Of course it was. Absolutely absurd that the rules can declare a winner after only 3 laps too. At least in cricket, it's less than about an hour's play for refunds to apply . 3 laps is a tiny proportion of the overall race time. |
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 30, 2021 8:26:39 GMT
I struggle to even call it 3 laps really. 'Racing' laps behind the safety car should only really count if there has been some actual, real running as well.
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 30, 2021 8:51:49 GMT
Actually technically the results were from the end of lap 1 because when a session is red flagged you go back to the end of the previous lap! www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.the-fans-have-been-incredible-today-says-hamilton-after-rained-off-belgian.4AYvpqfPwhe3gE3h0Qo3Hb.htmlPravda-esque article from the FIA. Hamilton said he was disappointed for the fans and then just stopped talking apparently. They do at least avoid selective quoting in the transcript of the post race press conference but it's still pretty shady. No coverage of Vettel's comments either. Pretty handy reminder that we need independent media even in sport. I had been wanting Sky to sod off so that we can access the official F1 TV channel in the UK but perhaps it's actually a case of better the devil you know. |
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Post by muddyfunster on Aug 30, 2021 9:07:28 GMT
No less angry today. It was so badly handled. Showed absolute contempt for everyone by pretending they were still expecting to get a race in, hours past the point when they knew it was impossible. Every team and driver repeatedly said, there are no significant gaps in the radar. The communication of the situation was also terrible throughout. The FIA/team radio (whilst laudible for it's transparency) was pretty damning in exposing how muddled everything was at the highest levels.
I still assumed they were applying legitimate best efforts right up to the point when they red flagged it for the last time. If they really were trying, they'd have kept lapping for most of the remaining hour on the clock and if they'd simply run out of time behind the safety car, then you'd have to say fair enough.
Even one lap of green flag racing would have been enough to lend the result some modicum of credibility. Instead they just cynically did the bare minimum. Anyone who cares about the integrity of the sporting competition realised that the worst possible outcome was to award points without any actual racing. That scenario was easily avoidable and instead the race director proactively made it increasingly more likely, and then finally applied the coup de gras.
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 30, 2021 9:18:14 GMT
Seems like it's going to be swept under the carpet. Realistically there should be huge question marks over Michael Masi's ability to do his job properly, we've seen several signs he doesn't know wtf he's doing previous, but yesterday along with his cowardly comments about "Going out to see if it was any better" were just pathetic. His deer in the headlights uselessness with the Perez situation just highlight how out of his depth he seems to be.
Again it beggars belief that in the biggest Motorsport category in the entire world, there isn't a contingency for "What if it actually just rains heavily all day and never stops?". It really is 2005 Indy levels of laughable.
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Post by damagedinc on Aug 30, 2021 9:51:18 GMT
Playing devil's advocate (although I do fall on the cynical side they did it for money)
"Apparently" the weather radar was showing a possible window of opportunity, all the teams saw it as they use the same software and decided to give it a go. The weather turned again and was abandoned.
Anyone that has been to spa knows the weather is nuts over there and basically it's own beast. So it's not entirely impossible thay scenario happened.
However
....... even if that was the intention it doesn't look good does it.
As above the fact there is no contingency in place. Yes its extremely rare but surely just awarding points for quali be the fairest result.
Minimum of 25% racing laps need to be completed. That does not mean behind the safety car.
If less than 75% race completed award half points.
If no racing laps completed or less that 25%
Award respective points for quali
1 point for 10th
2 points for 9th
3 points for 8th
Etc etc
That way the qualifying position is recognised but without the big potential point swing.
My two cents anyway
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Aug 30, 2021 10:04:00 GMT
It's just it though really isn't it. They go to Spa every year, they know the climate there is completely at the mercy of nature better than almost anyone else. Christ, it was only recently Eau Rogue was entirely underwater because of flooding. That they seemingly aren't prepared in any way for it to happen is the most damning part of it all. They scrambled to classify it as a 'race' at the 11th hour and that all of the drivers seem to have seen through that pretty much shows it up for what it is.
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Post by Red_Bool on Aug 31, 2021 7:02:53 GMT
This made me smile
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KD
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Post by KD on Aug 31, 2021 9:12:25 GMT
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Post by Solid-SCB- on Sept 1, 2021 16:55:25 GMT
Raikkonen officially retiring at the end of the season. I'm not crying, you are.
Should kick start the domino effect finishing with Russell to Merc.
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Post by damagedinc on Sept 1, 2021 17:09:39 GMT
Seems that missed apex (and every other f1 news outlet is right)
Kimi retiring
Merc announce Russell
Bottas to alfa
Albon Williams?
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Post by rammy18 on Sept 1, 2021 17:32:56 GMT
F1 2021 down to £42 on MS store, in case anyone was waiting for a drop
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 2, 2021 12:55:28 GMT
As mentioned above, there's been a sense of inevitability around the fact that Mercedes are just waiting for Bottas' future to be secured before they announce Russell. The 'Bottas to Alfa tbc at Monza' prediction does seem increasingly likely.
Think it's all good for F1. I've never been a massive Kimi fan although I do think he was arguably the fastest guy on the grid in the early noughties. He's gotten away with an awful lot that other drivers couldn't by virtue of being 'Kimi'. I'm not convinced his performances have actually merited a seat since his second year at Lotus.
I'd love to see Illot get a shot alongside Bottas, as he seemed marginally more convincing than Tsunoda, Schumacher and Mazepin last year (though none of them seemed like megastars). If not he'll become another forgotten man in F1 terms (a bit like Da Costa) as I don't think Ferrari see much commercial value to him, and understandably, if all else is fairly equal, you pick the guy the marketing team like.
My guess:
Russell -> Merc
Bottas -> Alfa
Giovinazzi stays (assuming they'll still want an Italian)
Hulk -> Williams (as they'll need a team leader)
Albon continues as RB reserve (I doubt RB will release him until Tsunoda stops looking suspect - wouldn't shock me if he gets the boot fairly swiftly once Honda are off the stage)
I'm also pretty confident that Bottas would annihilate Giovinazzi, so that second Alfa seat will probably be available for 2023, to whichever Ferrari junior is flavour of the month. My hunch is that Arthur Leclerc, might be the next chosen son, but time will tell.
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Post by Flying Pig on Sept 3, 2021 7:11:24 GMT
What I don't understand is why Bottas would choose Alfa Romeo over Williams. He started his career there, and they appear to be on a more upward trajectory than Alfa. Obviously I'm assuming he has a choice...
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